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View Poll Results: What defenders will you start in your team?

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  • Hurley

    15 17.44%
  • Yeo

    24 27.91%
  • Laird

    67 77.91%
  • Hibberd

    28 32.56%
  • Howe

    2 2.33%
  • Williams

    13 15.12%
  • Sicily

    23 26.74%
  • Gunston

    3 3.49%
  • Roberton

    4 4.65%
  • Ellis

    5 5.81%
  • Rance

    3 3.49%
  • Simpson

    11 12.79%
  • Witherden

    7 8.14%
  • Vlaustin

    0 0%
  • JJ

    1 1.16%
  • McGovern

    1 1.16%
  • McDonald

    6 6.98%
  • McGrath

    15 17.44%
  • Weller

    1 1.16%
  • Mills

    2 2.33%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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  1. #421
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    Quote Originally Posted by freowho View Post
    I see a lot of comments about Lever helping Hibberd so does that mean it hurts Laird?
    Yeah i'm not sure but I feel much more confident with Hibberd than Laird as a pick. Hibberd also had that interrupted preseason last year although it didn't really seem to have too big of an effect.

    Laird may or may not have as much footy going his way now that Gibbs is there? I dunno but I still think Laird is as good as any to finish in the top 5 defenders.
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  2. #422
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    Laird , McGovern , Shaw , Sicily D/F , Coffield D/M (or Smith) , Naughton

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  3. #423
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    Laird is currently locked in but I'm having trouble separating M Hurley, M Hibberd, K Simpson and J McGovern for the D2,D3 and potentially D4 spot.

    M Hurley:
    2017 ES Avg: 110.13 from 8
    8 games at ES in 2018 with 4 in the first 6 rounds.
    2017 Wins Avg: 106.1 from 10
    2017 Losses Avg: 98.9 from 10
    Wins Avg since 2015: 105.75 from 16 (5/16 below 100, 4/16 120+)
    Losses Avg since 2015: 93.87 from 23 (13/23 below 100, 2/23 120+)
    9 games against 2017 top 8 teams with 2 in the first 8 rounds.
    Since 2015 he has averaged more post bye than pre bye.

    M Hibberd:
    2017 Wins Avg: 101 from 10
    2017 Losses Avg: 96.88 from 8
    10 matches against 2017 top 8 teams with 4 pre bye.
    In his 3 90+ avg seasons he has averaged more pre bye than post bye.

    K Simpson:
    Since 2009 averages 100+ against Essendon, Sydney and West Coast. (3 matches against them in 2018 and all pre bye)
    2017 Wins Avg: 109 from 6
    2017 Losses Avg: 88.25 from 16
    2017 Avg when disposals equal/exceed 24: 111.2 from 10 (3/10 below 100)

    J McGovern:
    2017 Domain Stadium Avg: 97.83 from 12 (8/12 below 100, 2/12 120+)
    12 matches at Optus Stadium in 2018 with 7 pre bye.
    2017 DS Wins: 93.78 from 9 (7/9 below 100, 1/9 120+)
    2017 DS Losses: 110 from 3 (1/3 below 100, 1/3 120+)
    6/12 matches at Optus Stadium against 2017 top 8 teams.

    Which 2 players from the aforementioned quartet should be starting selections
    If 3 were chosen who should be left as an upgrade target.
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  4. #424
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    Quote Originally Posted by Connoisseur View Post
    Laird is currently locked in but I'm having trouble separating M Hurley, M Hibberd, K Simpson and J McGovern for the D2,D3 and potentially D4 spot.

    M Hurley:
    2017 ES Avg: 110.13 from 8
    8 games at ES in 2018 with 4 in the first 6 rounds.
    2017 Wins Avg: 106.1 from 10
    2017 Losses Avg: 98.9 from 10
    Wins Avg since 2015: 105.75 from 16 (5/16 below 100, 4/16 120+)
    Losses Avg since 2015: 93.87 from 23 (13/23 below 100, 2/23 120+)
    9 games against 2017 top 8 teams with 2 in the first 8 rounds.
    Since 2015 he has averaged more post bye than pre bye.

    M Hibberd:
    2017 Wins Avg: 101 from 10
    2017 Losses Avg: 96.88 from 8
    10 matches against 2017 top 8 teams with 4 pre bye.
    In his 3 90+ avg seasons he has averaged more pre bye than post bye.

    K Simpson:
    Since 2009 averages 100+ against Essendon, Sydney and West Coast. (3 matches against them in 2018 and all pre bye)
    2017 Wins Avg: 109 from 6
    2017 Losses Avg: 88.25 from 16
    2017 Avg when disposals equal/exceed 24: 111.2 from 10 (3/10 below 100)

    J McGovern:
    2017 Domain Stadium Avg: 97.83 from 12 (8/12 below 100, 2/12 120+)
    12 matches at Optus Stadium in 2018 with 7 pre bye.
    2017 DS Wins: 93.78 from 9 (7/9 below 100, 1/9 120+)
    2017 DS Losses: 110 from 3 (1/3 below 100, 1/3 120+)
    6/12 matches at Optus Stadium against 2017 top 8 teams.

    Which 2 players from the aforementioned quartet should be starting selections
    If 3 were chosen who should be left as an upgrade target.
    That's a very interesting stat on McGovern, 17 point increase in scores in losses. Don't suppose you have his win vs loss for away games in hand do you mate?

    For me Simpson is the one te be left out, I'm a long time Simmo fan but I think the Blues game plan has gone past the "get it to Simmo to get it out of the defensive 50" He's 33 and comes full priced and I just don't see any upside in selecting him in our starting squads.
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  5. #425
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRuss View Post
    That's a very interesting stat on McGovern, 17 point increase in scores in losses. Don't suppose you have his win vs loss for away games in hand do you mate?

    For me Simpson is the one te be left out, I'm a long time Simmo fan but I think the Blues game plan has gone past the "get it to Simmo to get it out of the defensive 50" He's 33 and comes full priced and I just don't see any upside in selecting him in our starting squads.
    J McGovern:
    2017 Interstate Avg:82.2 from 10 (7/10 below 100)
    2017 Interstate Wins: 88.33 from 3 (low of 52 and a high of 115, 2/3 below 100)
    2017 Interstate Losses: 79.57 from 7 (low of 47 and a high of 104, 5/7 below 100)
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  6. #426
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    Im intrigued by Hurley as an upgrade target if he drops a bit in the first couple of games after the interrupted pre season.

    Conversely, Essendon have a pretty friendly first 8 matches.
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  7. #427
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    Let's stop with all the McGovern talk please
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  8. #428
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    Howe (4%) and Tuohy (6%) are two options that haven't really got traction on this thread.

    Unless I'm missing something, I can't see a lot of downside risk with either*. I admit that they're not about to break a glass ceiling either, but given the chat about whether Laibberd are overpriced they seem like good options if you want to go skinny in Def and load up on super premos in mid. Alternatively, as a D2 or D3 that gives you a good shot at top 10 defs and reasonable at top 6.

    Does anybody have any thoughts on either/both?

    *Howe has had an interrupted pre-season, however so has Heeney and this hasn't stopped punters flocking to him.

  9. #429
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    The defenders is the line that I have been tinkering with most structure wise this year mostly because of the fact that I do not like any of the premiums outside of Hibberd and Laird. Luckily, enough rookies have showed up to make the 2-06 a viable structure but it is one that I am wary of.

    For this reason I have been looking at some value picks and breakout contenders to supplement the rookies and the one that I keep getting back to is Jacob Weitering. He has elit kicking skills, in his 3rd year, looked to play that floating defender role in the JLT and is a natural leader who I think will be one of many beneficiaries in Docs absence this year. Also, if I pick him the $ saved can either allow me to start Danger rd 1 or have enough left over cash to get Danger in 1 trade.

    So I guess my question is can anybody talk me out or into starting him as I am currently on the fence
    (I'm pretty easy to influence!)
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  10. #430
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woodsey View Post
    The defenders is the line that I have been tinkering with most structure wise this year mostly because of the fact that I do not like any of the premiums outside of Hibberd and Laird. Luckily, enough rookies have showed up to make the 2-06 a viable structure but it is one that I am wary of.

    For this reason I have been looking at some value picks and breakout contenders to supplement the rookies and the one that I keep getting back to is Jacob Weitering. He has elit kicking skills, in his 3rd year, looked to play that floating defender role in the JLT and is a natural leader who I think will be one of many beneficiaries in Docs absence this year. Also, if I pick him the $ saved can either allow me to start Danger rd 1 or have enough left over cash to get Danger in 1 trade.

    So I guess my question is can anybody talk me out or into starting him as I am currently on the fence
    (I'm pretty easy to influence!)
    He's not a bad punt. Good job security, hasn't missed many games. You could also look at Brayshaw and Thurlow who give you more flexibility with dual position, cheaper and a later bye that helps the sideways trade.
    But if the premiums look bad then maybe your expectations of a premium have to be altered. 90 ppg, 20-21 games could be a premium. Does that change your view of the other options?
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  11. #431
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woodsey View Post
    The defenders is the line that I have been tinkering with most structure wise this year mostly because of the fact that I do not like any of the premiums outside of Hibberd and Laird. Luckily, enough rookies have showed up to make the 2-06 a viable structure but it is one that I am wary of.

    For this reason I have been looking at some value picks and breakout contenders to supplement the rookies and the one that I keep getting back to is Jacob Weitering. He has elit kicking skills, in his 3rd year, looked to play that floating defender role in the JLT and is a natural leader who I think will be one of many beneficiaries in Docs absence this year. Also, if I pick him the $ saved can either allow me to start Danger rd 1 or have enough left over cash to get Danger in 1 trade.

    So I guess my question is can anybody talk me out or into starting him as I am currently on the fence
    (I'm pretty easy to influence!)
    Nice one mate, i thought i was the only one who was keen on him.

    Sitting at D3 behind Laird and Hibberd for me at the moment but whether i run with him come lockout is probably a different story. Similar reasons to yourself i reckon he's a real chance to breakout but the really down games is what has me not completely locked on him.

    Example from last year:
    Rd 18 vs Bris - "7th defender" according to FF, 5 possessions, 3 marks, 22sc
    Rd 19 vs Gee - "7th defender", 3 possessions, 2 marks, 19sc

    Those numbers are scary.

    But, it's not all doom and gloom but his last month is very decent:

    Rd 20 vs Ess - In defence on Hooker - 20 touches, 7 marks, 108sc
    Rd 21 vs WC - On Darling - 16 touches, 7 marks, 66sc
    Rd 22 vs Haw - Right shoulder soreness - 23 touches, 10 marks, 89sc
    Rd 23 vs Syd - On the resting ruck mainly Tippett - 24 touches, 14 marks, 113sc

    JLT2 - Seventh defender - 26 touches, 12 marks, 106sc

    I may look at Lloyd/Savage/McG instead and look to bring in Hibbo and Laird later cos i hate looking at their starting prices!
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  12. #432
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    Quote Originally Posted by IDIG View Post
    Nice one mate, i thought i was the only one who was keen on him.

    Sitting at D3 behind Laird and Hibberd for me at the moment but whether i run with him come lockout is probably a different story. Similar reasons to yourself i reckon he's a real chance to breakout but the really down games is what has me not completely locked on him.

    Example from last year:
    Rd 18 vs Bris - "7th defender" according to FF, 5 possessions, 3 marks, 22sc
    Rd 19 vs Gee - "7th defender", 3 possessions, 2 marks, 19sc

    Those numbers are scary.

    But, it's not all doom and gloom but his last month is very decent:

    Rd 20 vs Ess - In defence on Hooker - 20 touches, 7 marks, 108sc
    Rd 21 vs WC - On Darling - 16 touches, 7 marks, 66sc
    Rd 22 vs Haw - Right shoulder soreness - 23 touches, 10 marks, 89sc
    Rd 23 vs Syd - On the resting ruck mainly Tippett - 24 touches, 14 marks, 113sc

    JLT2 - Seventh defender - 26 touches, 12 marks, 106sc

    I may look at Lloyd/Savage/McG instead and look to bring in Hibbo and Laird later cos i hate looking at their starting prices!
    Awesome analysis IDIG! Interesting how those poor scores during the year were playing as a seventh defender but against the Hawks in JLT2 playing the same role he was prolific. Hopefully there is less experimentation at the blues this year and he can settle in.

    Yeah looking at the prices of Laird and Hibberd does make me wonder if there is value elsewhere. I'm Also looking at Lloyd and if I am not starting Laird then I am willing to cop the rd 14 bye.
    Savage is not one in my radar and think he might be fools gold but there are plenty of better coaches than me with him in their side.
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  13. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woodsey View Post
    Awesome analysis IDIG! Interesting how those poor scores during the year were playing as a seventh defender but against the Hawks in JLT2 playing the same role he was prolific. Hopefully there is less experimentation at the blues this year and he can settle in.

    Yeah looking at the prices of Laird and Hibberd does make me wonder if there is value elsewhere. I'm Also looking at Lloyd and if I am not starting Laird then I am willing to cop the rd 14 bye.
    Savage is not one in my radar and think he might be fools gold but there are plenty of better coaches than me with him in their side.
    Yeah i agree, Savage has the potential to make us look very silly! Someone mentioned the Montagna role and since then he continues to keep making his way back into my side.

    If he does settle in as a backman, i think a breakout is well on the cards. With Doc out, it may also allow him to pick up a couple of extra possessions loose that he may not have been able to if he was there.
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  14. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by IDIG View Post

    If he does settle in as a backman, i think a breakout is well on the cards. With Doc out, it may also allow him to pick up a couple of extra possessions loose that he may not have been able to if he was there.
    Definitely worth consideration - also like McGrath with the suggestsed midfield minutes increase and then was very bullish on Burton prior to the JLT however as it stands Weitering is atop of the list which is risky but hey where's the fun without the risk!!
    Happy with all other lines just this one I can't seem to get quite right...
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  15. #435
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    Quote Originally Posted by XabiFernando View Post
    Howe (4%) and Tuohy (6%) are two options that haven't really got traction on this thread.

    Unless I'm missing something, I can't see a lot of downside risk with either*. I admit that they're not about to break a glass ceiling either, but given the chat about whether Laibberd are overpriced they seem like good options if you want to go skinny in Def and load up on super premos in mid. Alternatively, as a D2 or D3 that gives you a good shot at top 10 defs and reasonable at top 6.

    Does anybody have any thoughts on either/both?

    *Howe has had an interrupted pre-season, however so has Heeney and this hasn't stopped punters flocking to him.
    I had Howe last year and would be looking seriously at him again if I wasn’t concerned about Moore/other changes affecting his role.

    As for Tuohy, I think there are worse picks you could make, but also a few better ones (and we probably only need 2-3 def keepers). Probably warranted more discussion than he has received, but potentially dominated by others unless you think he can improve a reasonable amount. Also has the R14 bye.

    One advantage of both is that they’re very durable. If we’re running 2 premiums and 6 rookies down back with not much backup, we will want those 2 premiums to be getting on the park each week!
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  16. #436
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    Thanks!

    Any changes in role that you've noticed in particular? As far as I can tell from JLT and other commentary it all looks really settled to me so maybe I've missed something.

    Re Tuohy - rd14 bye is very valid, but should be more settled at the club, is very durable, and just can't see a huge amount of downside for a D3 or even a cash-saving D2.

  17. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by XabiFernando View Post
    Thanks!

    Any changes in role that you've noticed in particular? As far as I can tell from JLT and other commentary it all looks really settled to me so maybe I've missed something.

    Re Tuohy - rd14 bye is very valid, but should be more settled at the club, is very durable, and just can't see a huge amount of downside for a D3 or even a cash-saving D2.
    No problem. I haven't seen the Pies play yet this season, it was more that adding someone like Moore (tall, presumably in a marking role?) added risk, and Howe scores best when playing back ... we don't want him moved forward to fill a hole there, for example.

    I largely agree re Tuohy, although I'd probably like to see a bit more to indicate he will improve again. He's 28 and seemed to score similarly both halves of last season, so I don't see much downside but he probably doesn't scream a lot of upside either.
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  18. #438
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    https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/...=rss_sport_afl

    Callum Mills' long wait for a crack in the midfield might be over as Sydney implements the next phase of its midfield regeneration.
    With Josh Kennedy, Luke Parker and Dan Hannebery leading the way, the Swans still have one of the most potent on-ball brigades in the league but are looking to give more opportunities for several youngsters who have completed lengthy apprenticeships.

    Big break: Swan Callum Mills is set for greater exposure in the midfield.Photo: Quinn Rooney

    Among those set for a longer run in the middle are 2016 Rising Star winner Mills, George Hewett, Zak Jones, Tom Papley and Nic Newman. The first four are all around the 40 to 50-game mark while Newman made his debut last year and is in his fourth season at the club.
    It continues a steady changeover for the Swans, who have transitioned former captains Jarrad McVeigh and Kieren Jack out of the middle in recent years.
    The courageous Mills has long been thought of as a midfield prospect but has cut his teeth at league level across half-back, where his precise kicking has been crucial coming out of defence.
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  19. #439
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bermi View Post
    https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/...=rss_sport_afl

    Callum Mills' long wait for a crack in the midfield might be over as Sydney implements the next phase of its midfield regeneration.
    With Josh Kennedy, Luke Parker and Dan Hannebery leading the way, the Swans still have one of the most potent on-ball brigades in the league but are looking to give more opportunities for several youngsters who have completed lengthy apprenticeships.

    Big break: Swan Callum Mills is set for greater exposure in the midfield.Photo: Quinn Rooney

    Among those set for a longer run in the middle are 2016 Rising Star winner Mills, George Hewett, Zak Jones, Tom Papley and Nic Newman. The first four are all around the 40 to 50-game mark while Newman made his debut last year and is in his fourth season at the club.
    It continues a steady changeover for the Swans, who have transitioned former captains Jarrad McVeigh and Kieren Jack out of the middle in recent years.
    The courageous Mills has long been thought of as a midfield prospect but has cut his teeth at league level across half-back, where his precise kicking has been crucial coming out of defence.
    So it appears Sydney have more midfielders than an under 8's squad
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    Quote Originally Posted by NT.Thunder View Post
    So it appears Sydney have more midfielders than an under 8's squad
    Maybe they have seen how well it's worked for the Pies.
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